Posted by MHK on September 22, 2000 at 09:14:18:
In Reply to: Re: Defining Buddy/Solo posted by Ken Kurtis on September 21, 2000 at 20:56:33:
Ken,
The problem with this list is that we spend WAAAAAAAAY too much time arguing and difending semantics. In another thread where we were yet again debating language, I defined solo and I made the definition as broad as possible for the very reason you are seeing here.
There are a few on this list that want to justify there position with respect to being underwater alone and will defend it with little attention paid to facts...
I have very simply made the point that we have had a VERY bad year here in So Cal. and a fair amount of the fatalities were from very experienced solo diver's and/or divers that got seperated from the buddy. So in simple parlance, at they time they needed help the most they didn't have it and they are dead.....
When I focus the discussion on the notion of diving with a buddy, it is inherint within the discussion that it is an attentive buddy. Everyone on this list knows that I subscribe to the DIR philosophy. There are communication issues with respect to DIR that I don't subscribe to. For example, they say rule #1 is to never dive with strokes.. You and I have had the discussion with respect to the use of the word stroke ( and as you notice I don't use it ) but that aside it sums up what I have been saying:
Dive with a buddy and one that will be there when you need it.. The fact of the matter most people may never need the buddy ( and hopefully that's the case ), but I liken it to an insurance policy. Hopefully you will never need to cash in on it, but the price you MAY pay for not having it is your life underwater.
As for your comments about rec.scuba and nobaody taking positions that discusses a buddy may be helpful etc... Take a look at the thread entitled * Dangers of diving with a buddy*. So you have some on this list that believe buddies are MORE dangerous than if you are solo.
At this point it is becomming counterproductive for me ta have these same ridiculous, childish and Bill Clinton-like, discussion day in and day out... If you and EINS, or anybody else wants to continue to play verbal gymnastics do so with out me..
So for the last time, I define solo as being underwater, on scuba, without the benefit of a buddy should an emergency arise.
How or why you got there may be a conversation you guys want to debate, but for me I don't care if it is because of poor buddy skills, intended solo efforts or what have you. While I have said they are valid points, to me it makes no diference as it boils down to the fact that you either have someone there when you need it or you don't...
8 diver's have died because they had no one there when they needed it, I have been accused of making these deaths up, then when I recanted the events of all these deaths, rather than EINS being a man about it and admiting he was wrong, he tried to change the definition. The family member do NOT care if they were buddyless, solo or whatever, the funeral cost just the same....
I am sick and tired of coddling issues that get misdirected because no one wants to face the facts and look them in the eye. I'm sick and tired of the cavalier attitudes about the rights of diver's to kill themselves. I also have rights, and it's called freedom of speech. For those who are unfamiliar with our culture, it is a constitutionally protected right that I can say what I want. If you don't like what I am saying then don't read my posts...
I have just merged my companies and I have less time than before to spend on these groups and I don't plan on spending my limited time debating semantics.
Students get less and less training, more people are gaining understanding and knowledge through scuba NG's and Ken you and I have discussed the notion that you believe tech diving is dicussed to care freely on these groups and that some may perceive it as easier than it is because of the bandwith traffic on these forums. That same logic applies to solo diving..
If I were to have put together a list of * How to tech dive* on this list I know you would have told me it would have been a less than wise idea. I think that putting together a list of how to solo dive may not been the best course of action...
Solo diving is a lot like buying a Rolls Royce, if you have to ask you shouldn't be doing it...
Ken, realize that some of the above comments are directed directly at you, but are more generic in nature.
See you Saturday night...
BTW, do you think the buddy issue will come up ;-)